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Thomas Cook, M.D.'s avatar

I suspect that >50% of what is called psychotherapy is an abuse of the insurance system to get basic human needs met; like the Japanese commercializing "snuggle cafes" in Tokyo

And perhaps, as you say here, as a society we have become so lacking in basic virtues of socialization that we pay a person to be a listening-whore rather than get the need met organically

James Taylor Foreman's avatar

This is likely the case, and only makes the difficulty of bootstrapping out even worse.

Daniel Duplantier's avatar

I’m an aging boomer. Before becoming a teacher, I was trying to make a living playing musical gigs, so I worked retail to make ends meet. That’s where I started to notice that small talk isn’t really about saying something clever. It’s about noticing people.

Even now, I’ll tell a cashier, “You’re good at that.” It doesn’t really matter how well they’re doing. You can see the little shift when someone notices you. For a moment, they’re not just the person behind the register. They’re someone who has been noticed.

That’s what I really liked about your essay. Small talk isn’t small at all.

James Taylor Foreman's avatar

Well said, Daniel. More of that.

Blake Griffin Edwards's avatar

I think what you're describing involves not just observational remarks but a level of attunement to the other and responsiveness that goes beyond the current idiomatic meaning of "small talk." Nevertheless I accept your attempt to either reclaim or redeem the term.

Giulia Venere Cassarà's avatar

It’s true that young people today no longer know how to make small talk. In my opinion, one of the (many many) issues is that they have less contact with their grandparents.

One of my fondest childhood memories is having coffee with my grandparents and the neighbors at 7 a.m. During that hour, they talked about everything, from who to call to renovate the facades to sensational news stories, taxes to be paid, politics… I just sat there, listening. Then, they would ask me simple questions, listening to my opinion, like I was one of them. Then, I would spend all my day playing with other kids.

With my grandparents I never had social anxiety, but once I got back in the city with my isolated parents… I was the weird girl back.

Joe Elefante's avatar

100% this, and also I felt very called out when you wrote about the people who hate small talk, because it me. One simple thing I started doing at my last two new jobs: eat lunch with my colleagues. I used to eat alone in my office or, even more frequently, alone in my car like a freakish recluse. Eating in the dining hall everyday with colleagues and talking about our non-work lives has completely changed my work environment and amount of daily socialization. I’ve also started going to after-work socials. It’s like going for a run - I almost never look forward to doing any of these things, but I’m almost always really glad that I did after the fact.

James Taylor Foreman's avatar

I'm also like this, Joe. Tend to babble philosophically, but see it as a vice lately.

Good to force yourself to do normal things. I'm doing the same. Keep it up!

Jordan Bonifas's avatar

I grew up in small town rural Nebraska. I remember as a kid hanging out with my dad, small talking our way through the day. Morning coffee at the CO-OP, with the seed dealer, the neighbor stopping by, etc. One thing that sticks out to me is there would always be silence in the small talk, and it was fine. Sometimes the silence would just lead to see ya later, or the rain, or corn prices, or sports, but the silence never bothered either.

James Taylor Foreman's avatar

A lost art, truly.

Andy the Alchemist's avatar

I am a little bit autistic and have never been able to consistently read other people as well as I wish I could. I try to make small talk with people because I know that's what is expected of me but honestly I hate it and it doesn't come naturally to me at all. I am always faking it and much prefer asking people about themselves and trying to learn something real instead of talking about the weather. Some people find me charming in small doses but I can't keep that mode of being up for very long. I naturally connect with other weirdos and neurodivergent folks though and they tend to be the only other people who can tolerate my weirdness but I only stop masking and show them once I feel safe to do so which can take a while. All this makes making new friends difficult because one way or another I am always in my head policing my thoughts and what I say. Being aware of these things doesn't actually make it any easier. My natural and genuine curiosity about practically everything is the only thing that sustains my conversational ability. But I am completely unable to fake it when forced to talk about something I have no interest in. Oh well, I am doing my best.

James Taylor Foreman's avatar

Doing your best is always charming to most people, so I wouldn’t sweat it. I’m also not a natural, which is why I write a dumb article instead of just being normal.

John Bunyan's avatar

My dad has the same disarming small talk as yours - it's one of the things I respect most about him.

Since I understand you're expecting (congratulations!), here's hoping we can be such good examples for our own children.

Justin Ross's avatar

Really great piece.

It's a paradox, really. And I've noticed it in myself too. We in the modern world have a demand for interestingness. Both out of self-consciousness ("I have nothing to say to these people, what do I do") and out of self-importance ("these people need to entertain and interest me or else"). And the more we demand this interestingness, the more we expect of the world to amuse or pique us, the less it inevitably does. It's a problem of being impossible to satisfy, and of not participating in the first place.

I have also noticed that people seem charmed and locked in when I'm just willing to have dull, boring conversations with them. Conversations that allow them to speak while I listen, or conversations where I notice something about them or their life. And, again paradoxically, small talk is how you get to big talk anyway.

Talking is like writing. In order to get to the good stuff, which you almost never expect and cannot plan for, you have to just turn over lots of dull-looking rocks.

Capuchin's avatar

Lovely essay as usual! It put a lot of my recent friendship experiences into words. I think another challenge is just trying to find people who are willing to engage with your small talk.

My own partner and I rarely talk about deep intense emotional stuff and our conversations revolve around funny things that we noticed, guessing games, light things. Which opens up at least two “arenas,” the arena of small things which is the realm of play, and the arena of “big things,” where we need to talk business and make decisions. This is where discussions of previous bad experiences, context and frank observations of certain less than pleasant things, takes place. I have my own ideas on the different arenas of a relationship where you relate to each other differently in each ring, but with this essay I can identify that I struggle to find friendships where the opening is not getting blasted with everything horrible that’s ever happened to them since age twelve. Or every conversation is a brainiac discussion of some societal aspect and the conversation feels Mysterious and Important. Maybe it’s just my age since I’m in my early 20s and we’re all a bit under-socialized. The effect is that the relationship is totally flattened, you can only ever have one conversation, and there’s a real sense that the other person isn’t really listening to anything you say.

What puzzles me is that the mundane is literally the stuff of life. Is it not interesting to talk about the little details? We all have to go to the dentist so it’s valuable to me to know that your dentist happens to exclusively carry sex editions of every magazine. Or that this year you’re putting up Halloween decorations and you have rolls and rolls of extra webbing.

Maybe it’s also the internet since there isn’t as much tangible interaction with the near world.

Thanks for writing this, it’s wonderful food for thought.

Dawson Eliasen's avatar

I think this applies to almost everything, and certainly to writing. Trying to produce "good writing" is a surefire way to produce awful, cringe-inducing prose. But it goes beyond prose into shoehorned deep/philosophical themes, inappropriate injection of morality, fantasy or scifi that is ruined by the imposition of "fascinating" wordbuilding, and so on. I've long thought that restraint is one of the most important yet difficult to cultivate skills, but maybe it's better reframed as "authenticity" or a willingness to explore "boring" observations

James Taylor Foreman's avatar

We live in a time of oversharing and public displays of emotion. Men especially, I think, should be forced to sublimate their passions. "Authenticity" as a term for most people is just confusing your passions for "the real you." I agree with your word choice. Restraint is good.

Douglas E. Dye's avatar

A most enlightening, edifying, and entertaining essay—thank you. Wishing you continued success in your endeavors. And please consider joining us in Bozeman in November. If you and your Better Half are interested, please consider sending a DM. www.arcata.live/2026-summit

James Taylor Foreman's avatar

Thank you so much, Douglas.

Lil John's avatar

My grandfather, when I came to live with him in my late teens, insisted I join his friends for morning coffee at the diner. Mostly men in their 80s & 90s, WWII/Korean war vets, talking about the weather, bad jokes, local goings-ons, and the time my grandfather fell off his tractor in ‘56. It was school of small talk.

James Taylor Foreman's avatar

We have a spot called Adam's Enterprises where old Southern men stand around (there isn't even seating, I think) and talk about this sort of thing at like 5 am every week. Truly inspiring.

Cody's avatar

So what you’re saying is I’m actually really good at small talk and everyone else sucks… now that’s a thought i can get behind haha

James Taylor Foreman's avatar

I can't verify it, but I believe it.

Cody's avatar

Means a lot

Luke's avatar

Always a heater. Really really good.

Blake Griffin Edwards's avatar

excellent